tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post5310406964477287290..comments2024-03-18T22:09:37.509+00:00Comments on Hyperlipid: Coconuts and Cornstarch in the Arctic?Peterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14527788116058656094noreply@blogger.comBlogger127125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-7697112343175917392014-12-10T09:52:34.674+00:002014-12-10T09:52:34.674+00:00Thank you Peter for this explanation, this makes s...Thank you Peter for this explanation, this makes sense to me now.<br /><br />I'm really impressed by the fllod of comments !<br /><br />Reminfkb0https://www.blogger.com/profile/18313043690714725141noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-55556942748412298842014-12-06T17:29:47.247+00:002014-12-06T17:29:47.247+00:00"This passage required at least a clarificati..."This passage required at least a clarification that Iniuts are not in ketosis, at least the nutritional one (when fed)."<br /><br />This is semantic, pretty much.I'm on a high fat, low carb, some protein diet with 24-hr fast at least once a week and my ketostix never shows purple.JohnNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07639308289155393659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-69235395672707767382014-12-06T17:21:58.557+00:002014-12-06T17:21:58.557+00:00"...a better definition of the word "ket..."...a better definition of the word "ketogenic"...should be considering the handling of electrons at the mitochondrial complexes, rather than the dietary macro-nutritional composition."<br /><br />I'd rather agree with this hypothesis. Few are willing to dig deep enough to consider what's best to prevent the gradual destruction of Complex I of the ETC and carrying out your own self-experiment accordingly.<br /><br />My own experience only: it's rather easy, from that basis, to develop one's own answer to the question "glycolysis or beta-oxidation, what do your mitochondria want and need?" I'd take that as my true-north.<br /><br />Moving beyond macro-nutrients, the traditional Inuit diet has something rather beneficial, copious amount DHA in the brain-preferred form of phospholipids.<br /><br />The current nutritional discussion (comments in this post and the subsequent post), tinged with evangelical zeal, conveniently omits the consideration that the behavior of a complex system is the result of not only the stimulus but also the initial conditions and its past behaviors.<br /><br />JohnJohnNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07639308289155393659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-41171666257034246022014-12-03T18:13:16.333+00:002014-12-03T18:13:16.333+00:00Greetings, All.
New post, recapping both of Peter...Greetings, All.<br /><br />New post, recapping both of Peter's posts on the CPT-1A mutation, and some of the stuff in comments.<br /><br />http://freetheanimal.com/2014/12/acknowledge-ketogenic-recommend.html<br />Richard Nikoleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08479556896882145179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-53386124317644112192014-12-02T04:00:53.965+00:002014-12-02T04:00:53.965+00:00Thought you might appreciate this article as a fol...Thought you might appreciate this article as a follow up to the Inuit discussions: http://www.cmaj.ca/content/early/2014/12/01/cmaj.140657Laurahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13328977255619747310noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-91907364976528735282014-11-29T19:47:37.300+00:002014-11-29T19:47:37.300+00:00Peter's posts of late are driving me towards m...Peter's posts of late are driving me towards more biochem info on ketosis and FFAs.<br /><br />Interesting Bill Lagakos ketosis review here <a href="http://caloriesproper.com/ketosis-in-an-evolutionary-context/" rel="nofollow">http://caloriesproper.com/ketosis-in-an-evolutionary-context/</a>Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12166369414769091805noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-52434256593786083072014-11-26T17:55:52.426+00:002014-11-26T17:55:52.426+00:00"We need a better definition of the word &quo..."We need a better definition of the word "ketogenic", which should be considering the handling of electrons at the mitochondrial complexes, rather than the dietary macro-nutritional composition."<br /><br />Talk about getting wrapped around the axle! <br /><br />How about this definition:<br /><br />"The ketogenic diet is a high-fat, adequate-protein, low-carbohydrate diet that in medicine is used primarily to treat difficult-to-control (refractory) epilepsy in children. The diet forces the body to burn fats rather than carbohydrates. Normally, the carbohydrates contained in food are converted into glucose, which is then transported around the body and is particularly important in fuelling brain function. However, if there is very little carbohydrate in the diet, the liver converts fat into fatty acids and ketone bodies. The ketone bodies pass into the brain and replace glucose as an energy source. An elevated level of ketone bodies in the blood, a state known as ketosis, leads to a reduction in the frequency of epileptic seizures."<br /><br />Just sayin'<br /><br />Tim Steelehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01611027687223434753noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-2107673799406247912014-11-26T15:47:36.437+00:002014-11-26T15:47:36.437+00:00Thanks Duck. I think we can safely say that Inuit...Thanks Duck. I think we can safely say that Inuit eating their traditional diet had large healthy livers. Nowadays on their diet of refined carbs they probably have large unhealthy livers.<br /><br />I must say I do like the idea that the CPT-1a mutation was beneficial because it made the liver larger and super efficient at converting protein into glucose. But why is it still beneficial? Perhaps we also have to say something about sparing fatty acids for brown fat.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16260696989450655181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-33635942664297286472014-11-26T15:38:55.326+00:002014-11-26T15:38:55.326+00:00"We need a better definition of the word &quo..."We need a better definition of the word "ketogenic", which should be considering the handling of electrons at the mitochondrial complexes"<br /><br />I think we need to pull out all the stops and go full sub-atomic particle, Jack. :)<br /><br />Look, it's pretty obvious to everyone that matter in the universe is composed of atoms. We could, if we wanted, frame everything we talk about in terms of the elements.<br /><br />I choose to frame things in terms of actual food people eat. I'm a constructionist.<br /><br />You aren't even satisfied with the elements. As a dazzle 'em kinda guy, your schtick is deconstruction and the elements aren't even deconstructed enough. This is a job for electrons.<br /><br />I told someone the other day in an email: give Jack a year, he'll be talking sub-atomic particles.Richard Nikoleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08479556896882145179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-37689307231393902672014-11-26T15:17:09.354+00:002014-11-26T15:17:09.354+00:00Nikoley and Tim are very focused on macronutrition...Nikoley and Tim are very focused on macronutritional compositions as an argument for why the Inuit couldn't be ketogenic.<br /><br />Peter's argument is that the cellular environment of the Inuit must have been "ketogenic" due to the mentioned mutations. <br /><br />We clearly need to step away from that paradigm, and instead ask what is a "ketogenic cellular environment", which could even occur in the presence of carbs. Conversely, you could be eating high fat and still not be "ketogenic".<br /><br />We need a better definition of the word "ketogenic", which should be considering the handling of electrons at the mitochondrial complexes, rather than the dietary macro-nutritional composition. Ketone level wont cut the mustard either. The better metric is FFA utilization at the cytochromes. http://forum.jackkruse.com/index.php?threads%2Fa-little-story-about-infrared-and-ct.9675%2Fpage-2#post-146732 The irony to me here, Is Rich wants us to totally disregard something we all fundamentally know is true. Mitochondrial input is run by electrons. The signaling molecules are free radicals with unpaired electrons and the complexes spit out protons. The funny thing is we don't know what they ate precisely but we do know for sure the food they did eat had to be processed by ECT and monitored by their unique circadian cycles.......so let just continue to let Tim and Rich guess about what we don't really know instead of focusing in on what we precisely know. LOL. Food is not the key. You need to know the circadian inputs to make sense of how food is handled in biology. Both oars need to be in the water or you wind up going in circles like most have on this thread. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06619419812590914435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-86583265641283032822014-11-26T11:40:55.548+00:002014-11-26T11:40:55.548+00:00I wonder if this mutation could be reversed by mod...I wonder if this mutation could be reversed by modern genetic or epigenetic engineering. <br /><br />Not sure if any of you guys are aware of the CRISPR/CAS9 genome "editing" tools that have recently been brought to public attention. <br /><br />The system was built upon the discovery of RNA interference from a few years ago.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00961432685340513136noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-61363862819731654372014-11-26T02:43:46.693+00:002014-11-26T02:43:46.693+00:00Jane wrote: "But it has occurred to me that t...Jane wrote: "But it has occurred to me that the enlarged liver seen in other cases of CPT-1a malfunction might be due to fat deposition rather than healthy growth. Do you have evidence on this? I haven't been able to find any."<br /><br />Good point, Jane. I don't know. The reference on enlarged livers comes from mentions of increased liver metabolism in <a href="http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1525/aa.1977.79.2.02a00070/abstract" rel="nofollow">Draper's 1977 paper</a> (Free Download).<br /><br />Interestingly, despite the whole paper being on very high protein consumption, he hypothesizes 66% Fat, 32% Protein and 2% carbohydrates for Premodern Eskimos. Although it's a wild guess, that's the least amount of protein and highest amount of fat I've seen of any estimate or measurement in any of the scientific literature.<br /><br />Nevertheless, Draper certainly did not believe the Inuit diet was ketogenic, except when fasting or protein was hard to come by.<br /><br />And as I wrote, above, Draper was referenced in the <a href="http://discovermagazine.com/2004/oct/inuit-paradox" rel="nofollow">October 2004 issue of <i>Discover Magazine</i></a>:<br /><br />"On a truly traditional diet, says Draper, recalling his studies in the 1970s, Arctic people had plenty of protein but little carbohydrate, so they often relied on gluconeogenesis. Not only did they have bigger livers to handle the additional work but their urine volumes were also typically larger to get rid of the extra urea."<br /><br />I assumed there might be a connection between Draper's comments and CPT1A. Needs more investigation though.Duck Dodgershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16841879655283106975noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-91355640350791161362014-11-26T02:24:48.482+00:002014-11-26T02:24:48.482+00:00---------
Basal Metabolism of The Eskimo, by Kaar...---------<br /><br /><a href="http://jn.nutrition.org/content/48/3/359.full.pdf+html" rel="nofollow">Basal Metabolism of The Eskimo</a>, by Kaare Rodahl (1952)<br /><br />"It was observed that the Eskimo groups that had the highest basal metabolic rates also had the highest protein intake when comparing the BMR with the urinary nitrogen elimination, the same positive correlation was observed. <b>The highest BMR's and nitrogen eliminations were observed at Anaktuvuk Pass among the caribou meat eaters where the fasting urinary nitrogen at times was as high as 3 gm per hour</b>.<br /><br />...It was also observed that the <b>basal metabolism was higher in the winter when the protein intake was increased, than in the summer</b>.<br /><br />...<b>It is well known that considerably higher amounts of protein are regularly consumed by the Eskimos (DuBois, '28), who generally speaking, prefer a diet where approximately 50% of the calories come from protein and the greater part of the remaining 50% are derived from fat</b>. August and Marie Krogh (13) report that the normal diet of the West Greenland Eskimos contained an excessive amount of animal protein—280gm daily—and they noted that there seemed to be a considerable delay in the metabolism of protein and excretion of nitrogen, only 60% of the nitrogen being excreted during the first 24 hours after eating large meals rich in protein. <b>In East Greenland the Eskimos consume an average of 300 gm of protein daily (Hoygaard, '41). In Alaska a daily protein consumption of more than 300 gm has been observed among the most primitive Eskimos</b>."<br /><br />--------<br /><br /><a href="http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=779864&fileId=S0029665153000188" rel="nofollow">The Diet of Canadian Indians and Eskimos</a>, by H. M. Sinclair (1953)<br /><br />"The skin (mattak) is greatly relished and tastes like hazel-nuts; it is eaten raw and contains considerable amounts of glycogen and ascorbic acid...There is in fact nothing unusual about the total intake of aliments; it is the <b>very high protein</b>, very low carbohydrate and high fat intakes that have excited interest. It is, however, worth noting that according to the customary convention (Woodyatt, 1921; Shaffer, 1921) this [Inuit] diet is not ketogenic since the ratio of ketogenic(FA) to ketolytic (G) aliments is 1.09. Indeed, <b>the content of fat would have to be exactly doubled (324 g daily) to make the diet ketogenic</b> (FA/G>1.5)."<br /><br />--------<br /><br /><a href="http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/25/8/737.short" rel="nofollow">Alaskan Arctic Eskimo: responses to a customary high fat diet</a>, by KJ Ho (1972)<br /><br />"Approximately 50% of the calories were derived from fat and 30 to 35% from protein. Carbohydrates accounted for only 15 to 20% of their calories, largely in the form of glycogen from the meat they consumed [in addition to bread and sugar]."<br /><br />--------<br /><br /><a href="http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1525/aa.1977.79.2.02a00070/abstract" rel="nofollow">The Aboriginal Eskimo Diet in Modern Perspective</a>, by Harold Draper (1977)<br /><br />"Because of its low carbohydrate content, a high concentration of protein therefore was an essential feature of the Eskimo diet, since extra protein was necessary to furnish the amino acids required for glucose synthesis beyond those required for body protein synthesis...Their high-protein diet imposed on Eskimos a need to dispose of an unusually large metabolic load of urea."<br /><br />--------<br /><br /><a href="http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/33/12/2657.full.pdf+html" rel="nofollow">The composition of the Eskimo food in north western Greenland1</a>, by Bang, Dyerberg and Sinclair (1980)<br /><br />"One of us calculated that the true adult Eskimo diet in 1855, with a little [bread and sugar] obtained from white traders, provided <b>daily about 377 g of protein</b>, 59 g carbohydrate, and <b>162 g of fat</b>."<br />Duck Dodgershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16841879655283106975noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-17568252894944299642014-11-26T02:24:34.943+00:002014-11-26T02:24:34.943+00:00Raphi,
I don't know what to tell you. If you ...Raphi,<br /><br />I don't know what to tell you. If you aren't willing to consider more than a century of scientific evidence, then there's really no point in discussing your keto-fantasy. I had hoped you were willing to weigh all the evidence.<br /><br />For those who are actually interested in the science...<br /><br /><a href="https://archive.org/details/meddelelseromgr511915denm" rel="nofollow">A study of the diet and metabolism of Eskimos undertaken in 1908 on an expedition to Greenland</a>, by Krogh & Krogh (1914):<br /><br />"The normal diet of Eskimos contains an <b>excessive amount of animal protein (280 gr.)</b> and much fat (135 gr.) while the quantity of carbohydrate is extremely small (54 gr. of which more than 1/2 is derived as glycogen from the meat eaten). Their dietary habits are vey like those of the carnivorous animals.<br /><br /><b>In our feeding experiments made under absolute control within the respiratory chamber we observed a maximum intake on one day of 1804 gr. boiled seal meat, containing 85 gr. nitrogen and 218 gr. fat, but this is far below the quantities recorded for Eskimos in the free state</b>.<br /><br />The <b>large quantities of meat</b> are well absorbed and utilized by the Eskimos. The loss of nitrogen in the feces amounts to 3—5 gr. per day and the loss of energy to less than 10% of the food.<br /><br />The maximum quantity of nitrogen found in the urine of one day was 53 gr. When meat was given after a diet poor in nitrogen, only about 60% of the nitrogen were excreted during the first 24 hours (from 5 hours after the first meal of meat to 18 hours after the last), 40% (20—30 gr.) being retained."<br /><br />--------<br /><br /><a href="http://www.jbc.org/content/80/2/461.full.pdf+html" rel="nofollow">Studies on The Metabolism of Eskimos</a>, by Peter Heinbecker (1928)<br /><br />"...The Eskimo dietary would not be expected to cause ketosis, because the calculated antiketogenic effect of the <b>large protein ingestion</b> was somewhat more than enough to offset the ketogenic effect of fat plus protein."<br /><br />--------<br /><br /><a href="http://jn.nutrition.org/content/12/4/337.full.pdf+html" rel="nofollow">Metabolic Studies Of Eskimos In The Canadian Eastern Arctic</a>, Rabinowitch & Smith (1936)<br /><br />"These urinary nitrogen data, therefore, support the view that the high concentrations of non-protein nitrogenous constituents of the bloods were not due to impairment of kidney function, but to <b>the habitual use of high protein diets</b>. In our food analyses, for example, it was found that the seal meat con tained 3.58% of nitrogen. One pound of such meat would, therefore, alone account for about 15 gm. of nitrogen in the urine and, as stated, when food is abundant, a healthy adult will eat much larger quantities."<br /><br />--------<br /><br /><a href="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1265375/pdf/biochemj00992-0035.pdf" rel="nofollow">The Relationship of Carbohydrate Metabolism to Protein Metabolism</a>, by Cuthbertson, MaCutcheon and Munro (1940)<br /><br />"In view of our observations on the adult human organism it might be asked how the Eskimo metabolizes his protein. The observations of Rabinowitch [1936] and many others go to show that the Eskimo does eat carbohydrate. For 2 months in the year berries, lichens etc., are available and throughout the rest of the year he obtains his supplies from the glycogen present in the liver, muscle and skin of animals. He relishes the stomach contents of the caribou and musk ox and the clams found in the walrus stomach."<br /><br />[...continued]Duck Dodgershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16841879655283106975noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-15308888347919129932014-11-26T02:19:06.390+00:002014-11-26T02:19:06.390+00:00This comment has been removed by the author.Duck Dodgershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16841879655283106975noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-91671317598792964932014-11-26T02:17:03.550+00:002014-11-26T02:17:03.550+00:00This comment has been removed by the author.Duck Dodgershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16841879655283106975noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-13689152896075902662014-11-26T02:15:34.614+00:002014-11-26T02:15:34.614+00:00This comment has been removed by the author.Duck Dodgershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16841879655283106975noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-63082416196737373302014-11-25T22:22:19.387+00:002014-11-25T22:22:19.387+00:001st Amendment: this is the correct link for the co...1st Amendment: this is the correct link for the continued hypercarnivore twitter convo which resulted in no bueno:<br /><br />--> https://twitter.com/CaloriesProper/status/500805051951353856Ash Simmondshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02912627973649715025noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-56624523396037577892014-11-25T22:14:07.896+00:002014-11-25T22:14:07.896+00:00This be so dumbs...
Can't be buggered reading...This be so dumbs...<br /><br />Can't be buggered reading the last ~10 posts but I saw mention of lions and hypercarnivory?<br /><br />*siiiiiiiiiigh*<br /><br />There is a TON of GOOD data about cats, because we can observe AND control what they eat and do - unlike humans (mostly) - go and read the damn things.<br /><br />I've read the stuff on cats, and the only bit that is completely unreferenced in the literature is that cats can't do (much) GNG via glycerol (ie fat burnin), which AFAIK is unsupported in biology (or my misunderstanding thereof).<br /><br />I tried to have a twitter convo with Bill and Wooo about this a while back, but it was frustratingly dodging of the actual topic and they kept bringing it back to humans/keto for some reason... (*sigh*)<br /><br />--> https://twitter.com/CaloriesProper/status/500778067090874368<br /><br />..cont..<br /><br />--> https://twitter.com/CaloriesProper/status/500778067090874368<br /><br />Anyhoo point being, no, we're not freakin' cats. Cats observed in nature are close to 50/50 fat/protein, and seem to have an obligate requirement for more protein for GNG, whereas humans are completely capable of supporting (almost?) all GNG requirements via glycerol.Ash Simmondshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02912627973649715025noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-82194103669933328612014-11-25T18:39:36.285+00:002014-11-25T18:39:36.285+00:00@raphi
You said: (I'd guess, 10-20%?).
Can...@raphi<br /><br />You said: (I'd guess, 10-20%?). <br /><br />Can you clarify the macronutrient composition? <br /><br />You mentioned a good point about the CPT1-a/b/c, I think they play a role, as well as other factors that can influence their expression (it seems there are many). I hope more research can help to prevent such a high rate of sudden infant deaths.<br /><br />Next I am glad the paper finally explained the paradox of metabolically healthy but OBESE Inuits. Of course, they only remain healthy if they keep to their traditional diet.<br /><br />Gemmahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18051515271519007652noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-888389754241793542014-11-25T17:24:06.866+00:002014-11-25T17:24:06.866+00:00And Raphi...really?
"A Ketogenic Diet is one...And Raphi...really?<br /><br />"A Ketogenic Diet is one consisting of a macronutrient ratio that is conducive to ketogenesis."<br /><br />Then why do they need Ketostix and <a href="https://www.ketonix.com/" rel="nofollow">KetoNix?</a><br /><br />Now who's re-writing Wikipedia?<br /> Tim Steelehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01611027687223434753noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-72785350483374589302014-11-25T17:16:54.478+00:002014-11-25T17:16:54.478+00:00"Ultimately, it doesn't change the fact t..."Ultimately, it doesn't change the fact that they're predominantly fuelled on fat"<br /><br />Shorter rafi: I'm just going to ignore 75+ years of research by actual arctic researchers and make an assertion backed by a popular, convenient arctic explorer.<br /><br />"The fact that Peter eats more or less protein isn't proof of anything, either way."<br /><br />And in the exact previous post:<br /><br />"They did not transform into lions. A veterinarian wrote this post and that should count for something (given his strong arguments)."<br /><br />Shorter rafi:<br /><br />When it seems like Peter agrees with me, an argument from authority is fine. When not, not.<br /><br />Shorter Nikoley: I'm dealing with a dishonest person.Richard Nikoleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08479556896882145179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-18417610924629903222014-11-25T17:15:14.717+00:002014-11-25T17:15:14.717+00:00Raphi - Surely you see the real paradox in this st...Raphi - Surely you see the real paradox in this statement:<br /><br />""[..] given the conditions above some Inuit suffer from 'rabbit malaise', a condition well known to these traditional peoples, seemingly the result of consuming too much protein and abruptly switching off ketogenesis. Given enough protein it is still possible to switch off ketogenesis as the variant does not appear to completely abolish malonyl-CoA sensitivity. It therefore seems likely that the P479L variant enzyme is an adaptation to a state of perpetual ketosis where a high sensitivity to malonyl-CoA would be undesirable."<br /><br />THERE WAS NO KETOGENESIS TO SHUT OFF. There was no perpetual ketosis. <br /><br />Unless this is describing the first couple Inuit that wandered to the Arctic Ocean, the ones that died out because they DID make ketones normally, then that entire statement is based on the fairytale that the Inuit lived in 24/7 ketosis as so many would love to believe.<br /><br /><br />Tim Steelehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01611027687223434753noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-66007188840426935162014-11-25T16:47:50.141+00:002014-11-25T16:47:50.141+00:00@RN
Your confusing ad hominem attacks on a dead m...@RN<br /><br />Your confusing ad hominem attacks on a dead man with scientific argumentation.<br /><br />The fact that Peter eats more or less protein isn't proof of anything, either way.raphihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08992252569979714724noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-87989503404628842082014-11-25T16:41:55.785+00:002014-11-25T16:41:55.785+00:00@Gemma
I'm not sure what the precise macronut...@Gemma<br /><br />I'm not sure what the precise macronutrient composition is. I keep a significant margin of error 'in my mind' (I'd guess, 10-20%?). Why? Ultimately, it doesn't change the fact that they're predominantly fuelled on fat, fat adapted beasts. Also, it leaves open the possibility that I may not know the extents to which their metabolism(s) can adapt or how their genetics play into it. You live, you learn!<br /><br />What we do know is that glucose is available in quantities that cannot be used for fuelling & that food sources of fat & protein were plentiful. Sometimes, fat would lack & they could temporarily rely more protein for survival, not for thriving. They did not transform into lions. A veterinarian wrote this post and that should count for something (given his strong arguments).<br /><br />This makes them obligate fat burners, however you slice it. Arguing otherwise is not a position I'd be comfortable with (to put it gently).<br /><br />As we can see from observing couch potatoes all the way to high level athletes nowadays, a state of ketosis (say, >0.5mmol/L) can be achieved with 0 up to ~150g CHO (by some accounts: see Ben Greenfileds lab biopsies with Volek). Insulin sensitivity, protein intake, circadian timing, glycogen depletion, stress, individual SNPs & a b*tt load of other stuff can shift you in or out of ketosis. <br /><br />I think people call that "life". There were no coconuts or cornstarch in the Arctic.<br /><br />What's your idea?raphihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08992252569979714724noreply@blogger.com