tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post7359496571703602190..comments2024-03-29T06:45:45.894+00:00Comments on Hyperlipid: Fancy some serology?Peterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14527788116058656094noreply@blogger.comBlogger46125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-65935058419869066362020-06-10T19:25:18.355+00:002020-06-10T19:25:18.355+00:00June 2, 2020
"Association of Blood Glucose C...June 2, 2020<br /><br />"Association of Blood Glucose Control and Outcomes in Patients with COVID-19 and Pre-existing Type 2 Diabetes"<br /><br />Highlights<br />• A cohort of 7,337 COVID-19 patients with or without diabetes was retrospectively studied<br />• Diabetes status increased the need for medical interventions during COVID-19<br />• Diabetes status increased the mortality risk of patients with COVID-19<br />• Well-controlled blood glucose correlated with improved outcomes in infected patients<br /><br />https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1550413120302382cavenewthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08461541719892430585noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-40476086740980785262020-05-20T09:31:46.698+00:002020-05-20T09:31:46.698+00:00LOL and LOL
PeterLOL and LOL<br /><br />PeterPeterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14527788116058656094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-11446440634527902692020-05-20T09:11:49.560+00:002020-05-20T09:11:49.560+00:00Peter I notice you managed to have the 42nd commen...Peter I notice you managed to have the 42nd comment there!Passthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-35152456289223129422020-05-20T08:58:51.077+00:002020-05-20T08:58:51.077+00:00Misremembered. It's 6 by 9.
"What do yo...Misremembered. It's 6 by 9.<br /><br /> "What do you get if you multiply six by nine?"<br /><br />"Six by nine. Forty two."<br /><br />"That's it. That's all there is."<br /><br />"I always thought something was fundamentally wrong with the universe."<br />Passthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-11682755644999029722020-05-20T06:11:03.839+00:002020-05-20T06:11:03.839+00:00cave and Pass,
I'm missing the significance ...cave and Pass, <br /><br />I'm missing the significance of the 7 x 5 array. Obviously 42 is involved somewhere...<br /><br />PeterPeterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14527788116058656094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-29942332488040030132020-05-20T06:09:14.732+00:002020-05-20T06:09:14.732+00:00Unknown, he reminds me of many of the speakers who...Unknown, he reminds me of many of the speakers who addressed us over the years at meetings of the Association of Veterinary Anaesthetists. The meetings were often joint with the medics. I loved that he found he was seropositive with IGG and worked the whole pandemic without PPE. Educated, sensible, pragmatic. A man after my own heart.<br /><br />PeterPeterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14527788116058656094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-70469877824181679682020-05-20T01:14:30.581+00:002020-05-20T01:14:30.581+00:00Innate immunity is also adaptive.
https://pubmed...Innate immunity is also adaptive. <br /><br />https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24997561/<br /><br />Wouldn't expect any less would you?Passthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-87481434726022315322020-05-20T00:43:08.466+00:002020-05-20T00:43:08.466+00:00A regular array of 7 by 5. A regular array of 7 by 5. Passthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-70917903758079509212020-05-19T19:24:44.201+00:002020-05-19T19:24:44.201+00:00Passthecream said..."ie cytokine mediated vas...Passthecream said..."ie cytokine mediated vascular 'loosening', porosity and infiltration of blood borne components into tissue. I wonder how this relates to arterial plaque, cholesterol, life, the universe and everything?"<br /><br />The answer will involve 42 of something.cavenewthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08461541719892430585noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-90311022297656558862020-05-19T10:41:56.726+00:002020-05-19T10:41:56.726+00:00Thanks Peter - glad you enjoyed the podcast. Dr Ri...Thanks Peter - glad you enjoyed the podcast. Dr Rich Breeze was a breath of fresh air (no apologies for the pun). <br /><br />For those trying to get a hold of the complexities of Immunology, the book by Daniel Davis, 'The Beautiful Cure', is a good start.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13329321371282836926noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-56716966302197474132020-05-19T09:07:00.605+00:002020-05-19T09:07:00.605+00:00At that link there is this diagram
https://www.nc...At that link there is this diagram<br /><br />https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK27090/figure/A55/?report=objectonly<br /><br />"Macrophages encountering bacteria in the tissues are triggered to release cytokines that increase the permeability of blood vessels, allowing fluid and proteins to pass into the tissues. They also produce chemokines that direct the migration of neutrophils to the site of infection. The stickiness of the endothelial cells of the blood vessels is also changed, so that cells adhere to the blood vessel wall and are able to crawl through it; first neutrophils and then monocytes are shown entering the tissue from a blood vessel. The accumulation of fluid and cells at the site of infection causes the redness, swelling, heat, and pain, known collectively as inflammation. Neutrophils and macrophages are the principal inflammatory cells. Later in an immune response,<br /> activated lymphocytes may also contribute to inflammation."<br /><br /><br />ie cytokine mediated vascular 'loosening', porosity and infiltration of blood borne components into tissue. I wonder how this relates to arterial plaque, cholesterol, life, the universe and everything?Passthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-21311488919002597982020-05-19T09:00:58.586+00:002020-05-19T09:00:58.586+00:00Justin, yup. A lesson I have learned over the year...Justin, yup. A lesson I have learned over the years is that most of the symptom relieving nostrums you could take usually end up prolonging the misery. I don't think the immune system is absolutely perfect, I'm sure it can over-react in various circumstances, but it is pretty damn good. Passthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-61377183833817580442020-05-18T10:40:56.184+00:002020-05-18T10:40:56.184+00:00Makes you think twice about taking anti-inflammato...Makes you think twice about taking anti-inflammatories during an infection as this inflamation facilitates the speady migration of neutrophils and monocytes to the site of infection.Justinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05688462291078238507noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-22402285681965130752020-05-18T10:24:28.427+00:002020-05-18T10:24:28.427+00:00Passthecream, thanks a lot for the link! I wonder...Passthecream, thanks a lot for the link! I wonder if there are any good YouTube presentations that would complement this? If I find one I will be sure to post it up.Justinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05688462291078238507noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-30616696915218792012020-05-18T06:57:29.186+00:002020-05-18T06:57:29.186+00:00A useful primer on various immune system component...A useful primer on various immune system components:<br /><br />https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK27090/<br /><br />"The innate immune response makes a crucial contribution to the activation of adaptive immunity. The inflammatory response increases the flow of lymph containing antigen and antigen-bearing cells into lymphoid tissue, while complement fragments on microbial surfaces and induced changes in cells that have taken up microorganisms provide signals that synergize in activating lymphocytes whose receptors bind to specific microbial antigens. Macrophages that have phagocytosed bacteria and become activated can also activate T lymphocytes. However, the cells that specialize in presenting antigen to T lymphocytes and initiating adaptive immunity are the dendritic cells.<br /><br />Go to:<br />1-6. Activation of specialized antigen-presenting cells is a necessary first step for induction of adaptive immunity<br />The induction of an adaptive immune response begins when a pathogen is ingested by an immature dendritic cell in the infected tissue. These specialized phagocytic cells are resident in most tissues and are relatively long-lived, turning over at a slow rate. They derive from the same bone marrow precursor as macrophages, and migrate from the bone marrow to their peripheral stations, where their role is to survey the local environment for pathogens. Eventually, all tissue-resident dendritic cells migrate through the lymph to the regional lymph nodes where they interact with recirculating naive lymphocytes. If the dendritic cells fail to be activated, they induce tolerance to the antigens of self that they bear."<br />Passthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-7152595207353059832020-05-16T10:08:35.724+00:002020-05-16T10:08:35.724+00:00Unknown,
Just got chance to listen to the ITU cha...Unknown,<br /><br />Just got chance to listen to the ITU chap talking about his experience of COVID-19. Very cool. I like the guy.<br /><br />Thanks for the heads up.<br /><br />PeterPeterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14527788116058656094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-85389474865070572232020-05-15T11:14:13.050+00:002020-05-15T11:14:13.050+00:00Only speculation on my part. I also no longer ge...Only speculation on my part. I also no longer get sunburnt very easily and I spend a lot of time exposing myself to it, even more as our local uv index heads below 3 for the winter. I work with primary age children R-7 so lots of chances for new colds every year. I sometimes feel one starting up and it quickly goes away but at other times I go through the defensive stages one by one, occasionally ending more seriously. It isn't pleasant but I'd rather it happened than not because I'm guessing that this is a matter of different layers of innate immunity.<br /><br />Malcolm Kendrick discussed this paper recently: <br /><br />https://virologyj.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1743-422X-5-29<br /><br />There are many interesting questions in there. This is a good conundrum:<br /><br />" influenza mortality and hospitalization rates for older Americans significantly increased in the 80's and 90's, during the same time that influenza vaccination rates for elderly Americans dramatically increased [7, 8]. Even when aging of the population is accounted for, death rates of the most immunized age group did not decline [9]. Rizzo et al studying Italian elderly, concluded, "We found no evidence of reduction in influenza-related mortality in the last 15 years, despite the concomitant increase of influenza vaccination coverage from ~10% to ~60%" "<br /><br />That strongly suggests to me that innate immunity is key, and it is probably weak in the aged. All the Hyperlipid logic about metabolic health is relevant to this concept! If your innate immunity is not strong enough you are probably f$$#%t, plus an unhealthy lifestyle may also reduce your adaptive immune capacity. Perhaps you don't get to mount a good adaptive response unless the innate reaction is strong enough?Passthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-7006114243640034842020-05-14T17:37:42.737+00:002020-05-14T17:37:42.737+00:00@Passthecream—my comment was meant simply to point...@Passthecream—my comment was meant simply to point out that low-carbers anecdotally don't get various infections as much as people eating the SAD, therefore presumably have more robust immune systems in general. I know in my 10 years of eating this way I no longer get colds or other viruses, nor do I sunburn. <br /><br />Most of the underlying pre-existing conditions that predispose people to bad outcomes of COVID-19 are what we tend to think of as being caused by the SAD, with handicapped metabolisms.cavenewthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08461541719892430585noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-11931047982019547052020-05-14T00:16:08.671+00:002020-05-14T00:16:08.671+00:00Gyan, Cavenewt - need to describe what exactly is...Gyan, Cavenewt - need to describe what exactly is a cold??? Is it the immune system functioning properly perhaps? <br /><br />If you hang around in densely populated areas you are probably going to be exposed to more pathogens and most of the symptoms of colds are signs that your immune system is cranking into action. Just how far it has to go to fight of a new pathogen is going to be based on a series of consequences depending on the power and novelty of the pathogen versus the different defensive and barrier functions ie the complexities of innate defenses and adaptive defenses and whatever else can be thrown at it.<br /><br />Antibiotics and vaccines wouldn't be necessary if healthy people didn't die of infection! There are plenty of horror stories of native peoples around the world dying by their thousands when first exposed to western diseases such as measles and other common viruses. I'm sure you can have a lifestyle which doesn't only not lower your odds of fighting off pathogens but also increases those odds, but there is a deadly ongoing struggle between evolving pathogens and evolving humans.<br /><br /><br />Btw, cholera, enh. SNAFU 130 yrs ago:<br />https://www.npr.org/2020/05/06/849996451/what-hamburgs-missteps-in-1892-cholera-outbreak-can-teach-us-about-covid-19-respPassthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-51308752606221876932020-05-13T18:47:01.704+00:002020-05-13T18:47:01.704+00:00Unknown,
Thanks for the links. Fascinating prese...Unknown, <br /><br />Thanks for the links. Fascinating presentations.LA_Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09775262019154051166noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-74554170779140389902020-05-13T18:02:49.408+00:002020-05-13T18:02:49.408+00:00Gyan said..."I have a naive question. Given t...Gyan said..."I have a naive question. Given that a person suffers from common cold repeatedly, what does it say about that person's innate immune system? Not very good, I guess."<br /><br />Which is related to what Peter said above about the innate immune system being damaged by anti-evolutionary eating ("avoid being diabetic"). In support of this, there is the well-known anecdotal evidence of low-carb eaters experiencing very few if any colds and other infectious ailments. And I appreciate Peter pointing out the difference between the innate and adaptive immune systems.<br /><br />As a tangential aside, and as someone who has a rare mystery neuropathy that is commonly considered to be autoimmune, I think it's kind of dumb to refer to someone's immune system as being too "strong" or "overactive". I prefer to think of the immune system in these cases as, instead, *misdirected*. And because of my situation I have been reading for 10 years about the immune system and autoimmunity and have concluded that it's such a complex system, modern medicine knows next to nothing about it, but is too arrogant to admit it.cavenewthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08461541719892430585noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-34331196307183236502020-05-13T08:24:25.478+00:002020-05-13T08:24:25.478+00:00@Gyan yes, viral loads were equivalent in symptoma...@Gyan yes, viral loads were equivalent in symptomatic and asymptomatic patients.<br /><br />Disagree with the immune system. Evolutionary, half of the children die because of evolution, survival of the fittest. Having half of them die ensures a reasonable selection process in early age. Today we have less children, but keep them alive with medication. Which is a good thing of course. Still, without modern medicine we'd see a lot of children die. But not from COVID-19.Frunobulaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11809778379384984029noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-32443602702908793282020-05-13T07:52:15.095+00:002020-05-13T07:52:15.095+00:00The Royal College of Pathologist's Serology ta...The Royal College of Pathologist's Serology talk is now available: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCKnfpsTBFk<br /><br />Found this interesting too. An interview with Consultant Dr Rich Breeze: https://anchor.fm/wdgll/episodes/23-COVID-19-ICU-care--long-term-effects-and-immunity-with-Dr-Richard-Breeze-edaopg/a-a21t9ab<br /><br />He has led Lewisham Hospital ICU during the pandemic. Interesting views on Serology too.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13329321371282836926noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-13073968485460683612020-05-13T06:58:27.486+00:002020-05-13T06:58:27.486+00:00Were these children asymptotic?
In an evolutionar...Were these children asymptotic?<br /><br />In an evolutionary sense, the immune system of children is as strong as it should be. Unless we poison it by engaging in things that evolution had not equipped us for. As children have lesser exposure to these things than adults, the children are less poisoned than the adults. <br /><br />I have a naive question. Given that a person suffers from common cold repeatedly, what does it say about that person's innate immune system? Not very good, I guess. Gyanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09941686166886986037noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-44183967935858275822020-05-13T05:59:29.567+00:002020-05-13T05:59:29.567+00:00@Gyan, we had a very recent study about the infect...@Gyan, we had a very recent study about the infectiousness of children: https://zoonosen.charite.de/fileadmin/user_upload/microsites/m_cc05/virologie-ccm/dateien_upload/Weitere_Dateien/analysis-of-SARS-CoV-2-viral-load-by-patient-age.pdf<br />"Children may be as infectious as adults."<br /><br />Young children do not have a strong immune system. If you consider diseases like influenza, young children are a high risk group. If you ever had a child, you know they come down with something every other week in kindergarden age. Historically, more than half of the children would die from diseases. This is because their immune system needs to learn to detect all those enemies. They do get COVID-19 allright and have a high viral load, they just don't show any symptoms. <br /><br />Assuming that metabolic damage is to blame would be simple application of occams razor, IMO.Frunobulaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11809778379384984029noreply@blogger.com