tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post6248906131232904532..comments2024-03-27T22:57:00.742+00:00Comments on Hyperlipid: Boiled mashed potatoes for miracle satiety?Peterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14527788116058656094noreply@blogger.comBlogger80125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-28262817169330129882024-02-10T19:52:28.181+00:002024-02-10T19:52:28.181+00:00Dang!! A reunion!! YAY!!Dang!! A reunion!! YAY!!TShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02619801349635491309noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-69320665311076637702016-05-24T01:21:48.527+00:002016-05-24T01:21:48.527+00:00My post ended rather more abruptly yest as I was a...My post ended rather more abruptly yest as I was about to run out of internet time, and I had to rush it toward the end of my post.<br /><br />What I want to add is that I am not against high-fat diets, and even keto diets, full stop. I understand that in the end we have to do what works best for our individual bodies. What I am against is how high-fat diets, and especially keto diets, have been pushed by some in the past as being the first port-of-call for a fat person to go to in order to lose weight. <br /><br />If I remember correctly, I think Woo has said in the past that, for example, keto is not for everyone except for those who really need to be on such a diet (I apologise Woo if I have mistakenly put words into your mouth, but this is my recall of the gist of what Woo has stated in the past). If someone needs to be on keto, or feels that this kind of diet is the only option that works (at least to some degree), then they should indeed be on a keto diet. Individual needs must come first. What I don't like is high-fat diets, and especially keto diets, being pushed by some people as being the only diet worth pursuing by an overweight individual (and I am not saying that you think this way raphi, but some people have in the past done this).Michael44https://www.blogger.com/profile/07592779181991483290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-31402002040832567092016-05-23T06:16:25.973+00:002016-05-23T06:16:25.973+00:00Yes Raphi, I shouldn't have said "can qui...Yes Raphi, I shouldn't have said "can quickly unbalance a person’s medium to long term nutrient status if they are not careful". I should have said instead "could possibly unbalance a person’s medium to long term nutrient status if they are not careful”, as I am speculating and I certainly do not know. But, surely mine and others speculation regarding this point should at least be considered, even if it does turn out to be wrong. Also, I will start using the terms “micronutrient” and “macro nutrient as Passthecream has mentioned that fat is, of course, a nutrient.<br /><br />I am talking about high-quality butter by the way, but, the only reason I used butter as the example is because Richard had mentioned it in his previous post. I could have included, and will now, lard, beef and lamb tallow, and coconut oil, as being other foods that high-fat dieters may and often do include in their diets. All these foods have a limited micronutrient profile relative to their energy content.<br /><br />Raphi, some people have, and are, reporting that they have become sick on a high-fat diet. As to why, well, I don’t know, but it is surely logical to look at micronutrient imbalance as one possible reason that this is happening in at least some cases (although I suspect the number one reason is probably simply that these people are not getting an adequate level of carbohydrate in their diets).<br /><br />You said – “First, if one is not eating a nutrient dense diet overall, that is a problem in & of itself. It probably is not caused by the fact that someone is eating 'a lot of butter'. I've yet to come across a single person or case study where nutrient deficiency or obesity occurred (as per your 'making up the difference' suggestion) by butter displacing nutrient dense food. Have you? If so, please do share.”<br /><br />Raphi, have you come across high-fat dieters who are struggling with their health and who may be feeling worse off since they went onto a high-fat diet? Have you found out what their bodys’ nutrient status’ are? Are you involved on a clinical basis with them? Are you a research scientist who has investigated nutrient status’ in people who are struggling on high-fat diets? If you have experience with this, then I will take on board what you have found out and do my best to have an open mind as to what results you have found.<br /><br />Regarding me, no, I have not come across studies that confirm nutrient imbalances amongst struggling high-fat dieters and I don’t know any high-fat dieters full stop. Having said that,I haven’t looked yet. That is something I plan to look into.<br />You said – “Second, butter is not pizza - it is self-limiting. Have you tried making a meal (not just a snack) of butter alone? I'm guessing not. Nor do I know of any sane person who has.”<br /><br />Well, there are people who consume fats such as butter, lard, tallow etc. and, there are people who make these fats the star of their dinner plate. They are the keto-dieters, and, by definition, they have to have meals that, on average, consist of approx. 80% of their calories in the form of fat.<br /><br />In the end, this all probably gets back to the issue of what are humans, in general, naturally evolved to eat? What is the sweet spot for fat calorie percentage? Maybe humans are evolved to get a quite significant amount of their calories from fat, and still maintain an optimal micro nutrient profile. However, I am extremely confident that long-term ketogenic diets are not natural. I am not saying that you believe in keto diets. I don’t know what your view is of them.<br /> <br />Possible micronutrient deficiency and imbalance issues surely should be at least investigated I believe.Michael44https://www.blogger.com/profile/07592779181991483290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-24188666646643336182016-05-20T15:02:47.983+00:002016-05-20T15:02:47.983+00:00@Michael44,
You said "a food like butter can...@Michael44,<br /><br />You said "a food like butter can quickly unbalance a person’s medium to long term nutrient status if they are not careful". This is an exaggeration at best but most likely, false.<br /><br /> [Aside: quality of the butter varies considerably - are you talking about the dreary greyish-white or the bright-yellow kind from grass-fed cows?]<br /><br />- First, if one is not eating a nutrient dense diet overall, that is a problem in & of itself. It probably is not caused by the fact that someone is eating 'a lot of butter'. I've yet to come across a single person or case study where nutrient deficiency or obesity occurred (as per your 'making up the difference' suggestion) by butter displacing nutrient dense food. Have you? If so, please do share.<br />- Second, butter is not pizza - it is self-limiting. Have you tried making a meal (not just a snack) of butter alone? I'm guessing not. Nor do I know of any sane person who has.<br /><br />Your thought experiment does not have a leg to stand on in my opinion.raphihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08992252569979714724noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-13693682172902393332016-05-20T09:50:08.389+00:002016-05-20T09:50:08.389+00:00George, you may have misunderstood me.
No, every ...George, you may have misunderstood me.<br /><br />No, every food we eat does not have to be rich in nutrients. I agree with you.<br /><br />However, the more nutrient-poor foods a person eats relative to these foods’ energy contents, the harder it becomes for that individual’s body to obtain an optimal level and array of nutrients over a medium to long-term basis without that person really having to try and work at it.<br /><br />So, if we have a person who is consuming daily, lets say, an average of 800 calories of butter out of their daily allotment of, lets say, an average of 2000 calories, then that individual needs to become more vigilant in attempting to make their other food sources more nutrient rich in order to ensure that their body’s nutrient status does not end up becoming sub-par over time, or, that they get fat by trying to make up the nutrient deficit by consistently going over their 2000 calorie daily allotment, or both.<br /><br />So, what I am saying (and I believe it is what Richard was implying), is that it is a very good thing to be mindful of, that a food like butter can quickly unbalance a person’s medium to long term nutrient status if they are not careful, and that it may indeed be prudent to try and use a food like butter as a small accompaniment to a meal rather than one of the meal’s stars, and certainly not for butter to become the actual star of a meal itself.<br /><br /><br />In relation to whole foods, I am not saying that they are the only foods a person should eat, but, just that it becomes harder for the body to maintain optimal nutrient status over the medium to longer-term the less often that they are eaten. Now, of course, someone can become nutrient overloaded and/or unbalanced by eating too much of a particular whole food. I am not saying otherwise. A nutrient rich food is a good thing to consume (and to continue to consume) until it possibly becomes a bad thing. Balance of a number of foods is key, just like what has been done, and is still being done, in many successful and long-term healthy cultures throughout our planet over the past few thousand years or so.Michael44https://www.blogger.com/profile/07592779181991483290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-18928477599535657812016-05-19T06:50:33.706+00:002016-05-19T06:50:33.706+00:00@George,
Spot on! We can & should (in my opin...@George,<br /><br />Spot on! We can & should (in my opinion) prioritize the general heuristic of nutrient density for the overall die all the while recognizing that the rule need not apply strictly on a per-food basis.raphihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08992252569979714724noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-59041451198477452242016-05-18T11:35:26.925+00:002016-05-18T11:35:26.925+00:00George, remember that fats are nutrients!
:-)
Be...George, remember that fats are nutrients!<br /><br />:-)<br /><br />Best to stay away from those potatoes though: <br /><br />http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/may/17/potato-blight-eating-spuds-four-times-a-week-could-be-harmfulPassthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-10718852221634988022016-05-17T23:28:00.298+00:002016-05-17T23:28:00.298+00:00Butter has a limited nutrient content. Sure. But d...Butter has a limited nutrient content. Sure. But does everything we eat have to be rich in nutrients?<br />We evolved eating foods rich in anti-nutrients like phytates and oxalate. Our ancestors may have had to eat lots of these to survive at those times when animal foods were scarce. These are still considered healthfoods today. Some vitamins (looking at you biotin) have such a high affinity for apoenzymes that deficiency is practically unheard of even on refined diets.<br />I frequent pyridoxine toxicity forums where some people sensitive to B6 (due to exposure to supplementation or supplemented foods) can now have their neuropathy triggered by certain wholefoods rich in B6.<br />I reckon that if you want an advantage from butter, or coconut oil (and there pretty certainly are these advantages overall) the odds are that you can afford the limited nutrition resulting.<br />Are we talking about using these foods "in moderation"?<br />Well let me ask you - when was the last time you heard anyone recommend that you eat "too much" of a food?<br /><br />Butter advantage:<br /><br />http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20150602<br />http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8325201<br />Puddleghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00953398103675945541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-80427936242410240132016-05-02T06:36:11.953+00:002016-05-02T06:36:11.953+00:00That doesn't change the fact that butter has a...That doesn't change the fact that butter has a quite limited nutrient profile in comparison to the energy it contains.<br /><br />Whole milk has a lot richer nutrient profile relative to the energy it contains.<br /><br />I am surely not telling you anything new here Passthecream.Michael44https://www.blogger.com/profile/07592779181991483290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-83708653957827325922016-04-28T14:45:25.060+00:002016-04-28T14:45:25.060+00:00Butter is no big deal, a red herring if you'll...Butter is no big deal, a red herring if you'll pardon the expression, and the French style cultured butters have additional nutrients. But you can get nearly all you need from simple animal foods and not have to concern yourself with plant toxins and allergens. In my (nut free) workplace i have to be aware of many children who can have anaphyllactic reactions to legumes and other vegetable protein sources but I have not yet discovered one who might have a life threatening reaction to fresh lamb chops.Passthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-78553546151299506262016-04-22T09:39:56.771+00:002016-04-22T09:39:56.771+00:00Hi Passthecream.
I get what you are saying, and y...Hi Passthecream.<br /><br />I get what you are saying, and yes, I think that you are technically correct in what you are saying, but, having said that, isn't it true that even after the cassava has been processed to remove the cyanide, that, as far as I understand it, the cassava still contains most, if not all, of the nutrients that it had before being processed?<br /><br />Now, compare that to butter which is one result of milk being stripped of many of it's nutrients. <br /><br />I believe that this is what Richard is suggesting.Michael44https://www.blogger.com/profile/07592779181991483290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-2038190285328256222016-04-17T04:24:21.828+00:002016-04-17T04:24:21.828+00:00There's nothing intrinsically wonderful about ...There's nothing intrinsically wonderful about whole plant foods. <br /><br />Manioc is a whole food-<br /><br />'There are sweet as well as bitter strains of cassava, but farmers often prefer the bitter, high-cyanide ones, because they discourage insects'<br /><br />Kidney beans are a whole food-<br />https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phytohaemagglutinin<br /><br />Castor beans are a whole food. Etcetcetc<br /><br />Very few unprepared animal foods will poison you. Preparation? We probably wouldn't have ever evolved to have big brains and small guts if we hadn't learned to do at least some of the mastication and digestion externally, via tools and technology.<br /><br />C.Passthecreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01214860448492630477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-62283232018469008262016-04-08T13:08:25.012+00:002016-04-08T13:08:25.012+00:00Yes, associations.
I have nothing against stone a...Yes, associations.<br /><br />I have nothing against stone age processing of food, be that cutting, cooking, drying, salting, fermenting - or churning. Maybe it is in my genes? Old tech tricks have always been needed and used here, in order to survive winters. <br /><br />The other option, transporting fresh food from the other side of the globe is a very recent innovation. It does funny things to health, ecology, politics and whatever. Fresh produce from far is inevitably ultra-modern stuff, after all the high tech (biocidical, chemical, biological and mechanical) tricks needed to keep it fresh and edible all the way to the customer. Well, we all have our dark sides...<br /><br />Far away from taters this is. Better stop here.<br />Cheers,<br />LeenaSLeenaShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02068331185278930853noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-35610691035940880332016-04-07T22:19:57.016+00:002016-04-07T22:19:57.016+00:00Hey Charles. Long time no see.
Well, associations...Hey Charles. Long time no see.<br /><br />Well, associations. Everyone rightly gets their bias up. So perhaps it's a study of the bias of associated bias.<br /><br />Anyway, the only really prescient thing to point out for all to consider:<br /><br />- an apple is a whole food<br /><br />- an orange is a whole food<br /><br />- a potato is a whole food<br /><br />- butter is a processed food<br /><br />- an elk is a whole foodRichard Nikoleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08479556896882145179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-46161408398431327352016-04-07T17:58:23.601+00:002016-04-07T17:58:23.601+00:00http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2016-04/uoo...http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2016-04/uoo-ffa040516.php<br />Fresh fruit associated with lower risk of heart attack and stroke<br />Study of 500,000 Chinese adults confirms benefits of eating fruit<br /><br />Fruit is a rich source of potassium, dietary fibre, antioxidants, and various other potentially active compounds, and contains little sodium or fat and relatively few calories. The study found that fruit consumption (which was mainly apples or oranges) was strongly associated with many other factors, such as education, lower blood pressure, lower blood glucose, and not smoking. But, after allowing for what was known of these and other factors, a 100g portion of fruit per day was associated with about one-third less cardiovascular mortality and the association was similar across different study areas and in both men and women.<br /><br />Study author Dr Huaidong Du, University of Oxford, UK, said "The association between fruit consumption and cardiovascular risk seems to be stronger in China, where many still eat little fruit, than in high-income countries where daily consumption of fruit is more common." Also, fruit in China is almost exclusively consumed raw, whereas much of the fruit in high-income countries is processed, and many previous studies combined fresh and processed fruit.<br /><br />http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1501451<br />Fresh Fruit Consumption and Major Cardiovascular Disease in China<br /><br />CONCLUSIONS<br />Among Chinese adults, a higher level of fruit consumption was associated with lower blood pressure and blood glucose levels and, largely independent of these and other dAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10709553155869979806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-81230421612642518442016-04-07T17:58:11.501+00:002016-04-07T17:58:11.501+00:00Your thoughts
http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_relea...Your thoughts<br /><br />http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2016-04/uoo-ffa040516.php<br />Fresh fruit associated with lower risk of heart attack and stroke<br />Study of 500,000 Chinese adults confirms benefits of eating fruit<br /><br />Fruit is a rich source of potassium, dietary fibre, antioxidants, and various other potentially active compounds, and contains little sodium or fat and relatively few calories. The study found that fruit consumption (which was mainly apples or oranges) was strongly associated with many other factors, such as education, lower blood pressure, lower blood glucose, and not smoking. But, after allowing for what was known of these and other factors, a 100g portion of fruit per day was associated with about one-third less cardiovascular mortality and the association was similar across different study areas and in both men and women.<br /><br />Study author Dr Huaidong Du, University of Oxford, UK, said "The association between fruit consumption and cardiovascular risk seems to be stronger in China, where many still eat little fruit, than in high-income countries where daily consumption of fruit is more common." Also, fruit in China is almost exclusively consumed raw, whereas much of the fruit in high-income countries is processed, and many previous studies combined fresh and processed fruit.<br /><br />http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1501451<br />Fresh Fruit Consumption and Major Cardiovascular Disease in China<br /><br />CONCLUSIONS<br />Among Chinese adults, a higher level of fruit consumption was associated with lower blood pressure and blood glucose levels and, largely independent of these and other dAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10709553155869979806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-1452318549402643922016-04-07T10:47:49.052+00:002016-04-07T10:47:49.052+00:00Well I'm glad that there are some tasty potato...Well I'm glad that there are some tasty potatoes on your side of Atlantic, too. It is too bad that nutritional science publications coming my country are no better than this article, but I'll do my best to cope with the reality. <br /><br />As for the argument? It is not important. IF you really were lost on the article itself (where the amount of carbohydrate and fat calories made the primary difference, and that after that it was modified a little with fat quality) then... oh, just don't worry, be happy, you are still ok with your taters.LeenaShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02068331185278930853noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-91875075398733890122016-04-06T15:50:29.152+00:002016-04-06T15:50:29.152+00:00Leena
Not sure what the argument is. Nobody is co...Leena<br /><br />Not sure what the argument is. Nobody is constrained by the skin of a potato. Not borders and culture. We have small golds, Yukon and otherwise, and they make for excellent roasting potatoes. They might be 25 g each. One slices them in half, tosses in a bit of fat of choice (a good reason to preserve bacon fat), roasts at 400F for 30 minutes and if skilled, does a beef stock reduction (perhaps with garlic, shallot and mushroom...mashed and strained). One eats many of them, sopping up the concentrated stock reduction, thickened if one desires. A potato starch slurry is good for that. Probably better than corn starch.<br /><br />Or, one could get a Winnemucca baking potato, which can be upwards of a pound and a half in a single spud. One does not eat many of those in a sitting and one is advised to go easy on the added fat, else one might get an unwanted and unecessary calorie bomb.Richard Nikoleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08479556896882145179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-31205606474313879072016-04-06T08:54:10.620+00:002016-04-06T08:54:10.620+00:00Thanks, woo. That is how remembered american potat...Thanks, woo. That is how remembered american potatoes to be but that was some decades ago. Yet I thought that things could have changed as they did with people, who also were much lighter then.<br /><br />To Richard: We do not have 300g potatoes anywhere, and the 100g potatoes that I've occasionally tasted have lost all the real taste, too. Never mind, I don't mind at all sticking to these older and tastier tiny varieties, as long as they are available on market squeare. Besides, eating low fat and high carb is not an option for me. Been there, and each revisit (it still happens, but rarely) comes with itches and fatique.<br /><br />I live on butter, animal fats, broths and cheese. So far they are my only way to keep the biggest organ (skin) in shape. After 40 years of low fat & high carb with plenty of potatoes and grains the non-itcy, healed skin is a blessing that I never ever even dreamt of. And the bliss has naw continued for over 15 years, so I have actually nothing to complain. <br /><br />Cheers<br />LeenaSLeenaShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02068331185278930853noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-38580062548861990532016-04-05T14:38:58.143+00:002016-04-05T14:38:58.143+00:00I can certainly get on board with defending the ta...I can certainly get on board with defending the tater on the basis of not being as carby as some assume and indeed, it's a whole not processed food (boiled, baked, roasted...chips and crisps gets into trouble perhaps).<br /><br />A 300g tater isn't that uncommon. Large baking potato and most of the weight is water. Plus, if you bake them, cool, then reheat you substantially increase the RS so lower net carbs even more, get some colon butyrate action going, etc.<br /><br />I found that I actually enjoy a big baked potato more with just about a tsp each of butter and sour cream poked into the thing. Some salt. I eat most of that first and will end up eating 4-6 oz of a steak rather that 8 - 12. My German immigrant dad who survived on taters after WWII has been doing the same thing and happily shedding pounds at 78.Richard Nikoleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08479556896882145179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-77582902945528627852016-04-05T11:25:22.865+00:002016-04-05T11:25:22.865+00:00And we should not forget the "powdered food e...And we should not forget the "powdered food effect" of flour based foods (pastry, cake, pasta, bread etc.). While nobody really acknowledged or followed up on that intriguing result, I'm quite convinced that the effect is real and important. <br />http://www.gnolls.org/3409/the-calorie-paradox-did-four-rice-chex-make-america-fat-part-ii-of-there-is-no-such-thing-as-a-calorie/<br /><br />Potatoes are indeed moderately carby. When comparing to other veggies it has at the same weight the same carb content than green peas for example (ok one could argue then that peas are high carb, but your get the idea).gallier2https://www.blogger.com/profile/04285836062429366578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-44137477724734464032016-04-04T22:35:53.452+00:002016-04-04T22:35:53.452+00:00Leena, in america potatoes are usually much smalle...Leena, in america potatoes are usually much smaller than 300 grams. Thats almost a pound. <br /><br />No normal person eats an almost 11 ounce potato. If someone is eating that much potato they are probably also just binging on food madly at restaurant or they are on a weird potato diet.<br /><br />Yes, an average size potato is quite low carb and they do not deserve repuation as being very high carb foods. You can eat al ot of carbs in potato... if you eat almost a pound, and as Nikoley pointed out, you still only end up with 50 carbs. 11 ounces of potato, still only 50 carbs.<br /><br />Now compare PASTA, OR ANY OTHER flour based food: 83 net carbs in 11 ounces of typically cooked pasta.<br /><br />Thats almost twice as many carbs for a similar weight of food. And i would mention that this is only "two serving sizes" of pasta, i.e. 4 ounces dry weight, and MOST ppl will easily inhale way more pasta than that.<br /><br />OTOH, 11 ounces of potato = 50 carbs and most people are NOT going to eat that much. They will eat toppings, leave inside/skin etc.<br /><br />Yes, potatoes really are not nearly as carby as most truly high carb processed foods and TBH i think a big reason it works is you are excluding starches/flour based things , it's like a poorly designed/deficiency prone very mild low carb diet. Ironically.ItsTheWooohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12057537399918684119noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-57867649708715644152016-04-03T12:30:01.385+00:002016-04-03T12:30:01.385+00:00Very different the potatoes in America are.
The o...Very different the potatoes in America are.<br /><br />The ones I eat have 13g carbohydrates per 100g potatoe.<br />It takes 4-5 of these to have 100 grams.<br />Two per meal is no problem in LCHF.<br /><br />And they do taste delicious as mashed potatoes, <br />if/when prepared with enough butter and cream and a dash of salt. <br />Less than ten small taters are needed for a nice side dish for four.<br /><br />With love from a potatoe country in Northern Europe<br />-- LeenaS --LeenaShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02068331185278930853noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-24743431970943651682016-04-02T19:23:07.094+00:002016-04-02T19:23:07.094+00:00OK, one _final_, final thing.
Beyond the red herr...OK, one _final_, final thing.<br /><br />Beyond the red herring of protein sparing I already addressed, it is nonetheless interesting to compare the potato hack to a PSMF. While I've done a bunch of nutritional comparisons with potatoes, whole meals with lots of potatoes, big meat meals and big fat meals (the latter is by far for worse from a micro standpoint, since fat has almost no vitamins or minerals...butter is "magarineally" (ha ha) best, 'cause the solids), it's true there's a commonality of approach:<br /><br />1. significant caloric deficit<br /><br />2. very low fat<br /><br />I did that for perhaps two weeks in 2008, using Lyle McDonald's book. Results were not as good as the 1-2, 24-30 hr water fasts per week I was doing at the time. And it was way harder. It's crazy difficult to get high protein and very low fat (under 10%, I think was the deal) if you're going to eat food and not drink fat-free protein powder in water. As I recall, it was mostly egg whites and 96% lean ground beef, which is less palatable to me than a plain boiled potato with some malt vinegar.<br /><br />I think everyone can agree that both a potato hack and PSMF are effective for a lot of people, but given the requirements for low fat, the potato is a cinch, since that element is built right in and you have to go to no more trouble than you do to make a cup of tea.<br /><br />In terms of micronutrients, I was quite surprised how the potato stacks up (see charts here: https://freetheanimal.com/2016/02/the-potato-diet-practicalities-dropping-big-weight-fast-with-high-energy-and-without-hunger.html ) against meat. Of course, meat suitably repurposed for a PSMF would have more micros than a standard comparison, since you're trading off near zero-micro fat for micro-rich lean.<br /><br />But, all of these hacks, just like plain old fasting, are intended to be short-term intermittent interventions for most people, so it probably ought just come down to what works best for any individual. Unlike many weighing in, I _have_ actually tried them all and find the potato hack by far the most effortless and easy to do. I boil a pot of potatoes, with skins, pop them in the fridge. Peel like a boiled egg when hungry and eat one, two, or three. Over the space of a few days, they do tend to completely modify hunger and satiation signals.<br /><br />No idea why, though. I'll save the speculation.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Richard Nikoleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08479556896882145179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36840063.post-17092289168106728972016-04-02T18:18:34.722+00:002016-04-02T18:18:34.722+00:00...One final thing.
"Look, PSMF already has ......One final thing.<br /><br />"Look, PSMF already has been done, and it's much more reasonable/sane when you follow the rule to eat minimum protein to avoid lean tissue catabolism while doing your 50% cal deficit."<br /><br />In 1981, before Woo was born, 10 IRA prisoners went on hunger strike, died in the range of 60-75 days later. They were studied. On average, they had lost about 95% of fat stores, but only 19% of lean stores. Humans are lean sparing machines. You die when you run out of fat, not protein.<br /><br />All of this hand-wringing over protein quality and quantity over the 3-7 days people typically engage in a potato hack is what's really LOL.Richard Nikoleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08479556896882145179noreply@blogger.com