Thursday, October 08, 2009

Dead people DO bleed...

This one cracked me up. Okay, so I have a warped sense of humour.

The crooked origin of the lipid hypothesis generates an almost infinite number of paradoxes, here's a nice abstract about (yet) another paradox, this time in survival after ACS.

"The association of hypercholesterolemia with better outcomes highlights a major challenge in observational analyses"

Which prompted this anecdote from an eminent THINCS member:

A schizophrenic patient believes he is dead.  The patient's psychiatrist, trying to cure the him of his delusion says, "Do dead people bleed?"  The patient says, "No, they don't bleed."  The Psychiatrist pricks the patient's finger and blood flows out.  The patient says, "Well, this shows that dead people DO bleed".

Peter

12 comments:

Ukay Bukit said...

Quote from the abstract:


“…and perhaps most importantly, the fact that previously diagnosed hypercholesterolemia is a marker for patients with more prior medical contact ….”

This quote contains the implicit assumption that treatment by doctors who accept the lipid hypothesis is beneficial in ACS. Even so, it still seems there is a non sequiter there.

Heike said...

It's always disheartening when scientists band together, dredge data, conclude something and immediately discount it.

Since this post is about blood ... I would like to ask whether there is something about iron and iron deficiency on a high-fat diet?

I'm worried about that. I've cut down on carbs but lots of them are high in iron ... all the lists are topped by 'fortified breakfast cereals'. Yikes.

I like chicken liver but not bigger livers from bigger animals, it gives me a Lecterish feeling.

Any help???

Peter said...

Lutz is the only person I know to have commented on this. He only looked at haemoglobin, not ferritin,

If it's high it drops, if low it rises. I don't think there is such a thing as a low iron diet, especially once you dump the phytate from grains. With LC excess is more likely, though less so on the OD (lowish protein).

If you have an iron storage problem I doubt anything other than phlebotomy will do the trick...

Peter

Jim Purdy said...

I tend to test anemic, but I'm told that it may be because I drink a lot of tea, which may bind the iron.

kirk said...

Sorry, this question has nothing to do with this post but seems to be the only way I can ask your opinion. You've posted that antioxidants and flavonoids etc imply a harmful defense system of the plant. I've also read this account on the subject http://donmatesz.blogspot.com/search/label/flavonoids.

However, I've noticed you eat chocolate, which seems like the most extreme example of this. Can you share your thoughts on this? Thanks,
-Kirk

Peter said...

Hi Kirk,

Absolutely valid point. I am very very very dependent on both my liver to protect me and my cell surface xenobiotic pumps to excrete any flavanoids which manage to gain entry and disrupt the crucial free radical signalling which controls mitochondrial function. I should really stop but, sigh... My main happy note is that it doesn't look like huge doses of flavaoids, especially as in the WHEL intervention study, are particularly effective poisons. People in the intervention "healthy eating" group did no worse than the SAD group... So there's hope for surviving chocolate!

Peter

Self justifying and rationalising like mad, while sneaking off to find some more Lindt 90% cocoa choc to go with his flavanoid filled coffee....

homertobias said...

What???What??? Peter are you trying to imply that {gasp) some types of cholesterol may be cardioprotective? Perhaps that is why having higher cholesterol levels in your 80's is associated with longevity.
Seriously, I always have difficulty with cholesterol levels taken AFTER an acute event. Tissue injury mobilizes serum ldl cholesterol to help repair the damage. So perhaps lower post event ldlc is indicative of greater tissue damage, temporarily driving down ldlc. Of course, I would love to let Krauss loose in the house and see the true subfractions...
As to your schizophrenic, everybody knows vampires don't bleed. We need to turn the thing around, think outside of the box.

LeonRover said...

It is certainly true in my case, that prior medical contact in re hypercholesteremia increases one blood level reading - namely the systolic measure . . . . !

Peter said...

Homertobias. Wow! Perhaps this explains the massive protective effect of garlic against Vampires... They don't want the anticoagulant effect. What about silver stakes, any therapeutic mechanism there?

Peter

Jim Purdy said...

Maybe the silver-stake hypothesis would explain the fluctuations in the silver commodity market, including the huge spike in 1980. Were the Hunt brothers vampire-hunters?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ag_annual_average_USD_price_1792-2005.svg

Peter said...

Well the spike on the graph certainly makes a good design for a silver stake... What was that all about?

P

Jim Purdy said...

The Hunt brothers and others made an attempt to corner the world silver market. Their pockets weren't deep enough, and they lost billions. That happened when Jimmy Carter was president. Had it happened on GW Bush's watch, they would have been bailed out as too big to fail.